UPDATE 3: SHOOTER was a career criminal named WILLIAM SPANGLER – 2 firefighters killed, 2 wounded in NY

***UPDATE 3***

Per a press conference on FOX NEWS CHANNEL
– The shooter’s name was William Spangler (DOB 9/26/50) and he died from a self-inflicted gunshot wound. He killed his grandmother in 1980 and was convicted in 1981 by Webster police department. He served time in prison until 1998 and was on supervised parole until 2006. The police chief says they haven’t had contact with him criminally in recent past.

The police chief also said that it’s now 7 homes that have been destroyed and they believe (at first blush) that this was indeed a trap set by Spangler. When firefighters arrived there was one car and one home ablaze and they believe the fires were likely set by Spangler.

The 2 surviving firefighters are still in the hospital, one in ‘guarded condition’ and the other in ‘stable condition’.

***UPDATE 2***

Here’s the latest report and a mini-press conference from fire officials describing what happened and providing the names of the firefighters who were targeted by the shooter. The police chief nearly breaks down in tears reporting the names of the 2 firefighters who are deceased, one of which was a Lieutenant at the Webster police department:

Mini-Update: Corrected that it was the police chief and not a fire official giving the press conference.


Apparently some jerk decided to begin shooting at our New York volunteer fire fighters who had been called to put out a house fire in Webster. He killed 2 of them and wounded 2 more.

The latest reports are that the shooter is dead on the scene.

UPDATE: The latest FOX NEWS report is that the shooter is dead, but it’s not clear if it’s suicide or the shooter was killed by police. Also, the single house fire spread to 3 other houses because the firefighters were unable to fight the blaze in the first house due to the shooter. They also don’t know if there were people in the other houses. A news conference has been scheduled for 2PM.

‘Unsung Davids’ is a new and powerful book tells the story of ten heroes who fought tyranny and evil but are given little or no recognition. Click Here for more details.

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  • Conservative_Hippie

    Senseless! My prayers go out to the families of the firefighters that were killed and wounded.

    To my Christian brothers and sisters, pray for a revival that will shake the foundation of this Country! Pray for Obama’s salvation!

    • PatrickHenrysBody

      Mr. Spangler won’t get a lump of coal in his proverbial stocking. He won’t need it where he’s going.

      • Zanshi

        I disagree. How else are Hell’s flames stoked?

  • My heart has never been so heavy as it is this Christmas.
    My prayers go out to the families and brothers of these brave men. My prayers go out for our nation. It’s broken and so is my heart. Please Lord be with the families of those who have suffered incredible losses so soon but please Lord, help us to heal our land.

    • 12grace

      Yes, in many ways it is a very sad Christmas however, we must remember the real reason that we celebrate Christmas is because we were given the precious “light of love and hope” through the Christ-child. And no matter what is happening to us personally or as a nation, we still have that “light and hope” available to us, today. Our “hope” comes through HIM.

      Merry Christmas to you dear abc, and to Right Scoop and all those patriots that support RS and our America. May G-d shed his blessings on all of you this Christmas and always.

      Daily Bible Reading from BibleStudyTools.com
      December 24, 2012 – King James Version
      Luke 2:1-20

      1 And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that all the world should be taxed . 2 (And this taxing was first made when Cyrenius was governor of Syria.) 3 And all went to be taxed , every one into his own city. 4 And Joseph also went up from Galilee, out of the city of Nazareth, into Judaea, unto the city of David, which is called Bethlehem; (because he was of the house and lineage of David:) 5 To be taxed with Mary his espoused wife, being great with child. 6 And so it was , that, while they were there, the days were accomplished that she should be delivered . 7 And she brought forth her firstborn son, and wrapped him in swaddling clothes , and laid him in a manger; because there was no room for them in the inn. 8 And there were in the same country shepherds abiding in the field , keeping watch over their flock by night. 9 And, lo , the angel of the Lord came upon them, and the glory of the Lord shone round about them: and they were sore afraid . 10 And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold , I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people. 11 For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord. 12 And this shall be a sign unto you; Ye shall find the babe wrapped in swaddling clothes , lying in a manger. 13 And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God, and saying , 14 Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men. 15 And it came to pass , as the angels were gone away from them into heaven , the shepherds said one to another, Let us now go even unto Bethlehem, and see this thing which is come to pass , which the Lord hath made known unto us. 16 And they came with haste , and found Mary, and Joseph, and the babe lying in a manger. 17 And when they had seen it, they made known abroad the saying which was told them concerning this child. 18 And all they that heard it wondered at those things which were told them by the shepherds. 19 But Mary kept all these things , and pondered them in her heart. 20 And the shepherds returned , glorifying and praising God for all the things that they had heard and seen , as it was told unto them.

      • Beautifully said my sweet grace. Thank you. I hope for a peacefilled, Blessed Christmas for you and your family! A safe and happy New Year too! xoxoxox

  • Orangeone

    Well doesn’t NY just offer up an invitation to the crazies by publishing the name and address of gun permit holders:


  • Linky1

    Since they want armed guards in schools, maybe it would be a good idea to do the same for firefighters.

    I know several firefighters and this will hit hard with them, as it has with me.

    My thoughts and prayers go out to the families.

    • joyfulgiver

      I was thinking the same thing. It seems that the crazies always attack the DEFENSELESS, Hello!!!!! Maybe the government powers should take a look at that tidbit of history. Even in gangs, they go after those that have NO weapons. Yet our govt wants to disarm us all. It’s absurd!

      Praying for the families of yesterday’s shootings, those who lost their homes on Christmas Eve in this senseless act of terror. And for all the people of Newtown. May Christ’s peace be at home in your hearts. We are praying for you all!

  • MiketheMarine

    It’s getting to be time for normal Law Abiding Americans to take our streets and towns back, by force if necessary.

    I’m sick of having to yield to the deficient and perverted.

    • aZjimbo

      It sure as hell seems we are getting to that point.

  • NJK

    I’m getting really leary of these shootings all happening now. Either the media is sensationalizing shootings now, or Zero is orchestrating them. It’s starting to smell really bad. Zero, Ayers, and their ilk, are involved in all of these shootings, somehow.

    Look at OWS. OWS, was orchestrated by Zero, Ayers, and the rest. If there’s anyone decent left in this Federal cesspool, please step up to the plate and look into Zero and his gang. They’re staging all of these events.

    • Amy

      It’s being sensationlized to the maximum.

      Speaking from my memory & some personal experience here… The issue of firefighters/first responders getting shot at is nothing new. I have family members who have worn bulletproof vests while responding to calls in certain neighborhoods. This started years ago. There’s a reason first responders have police escorts in a lot of cities. People are demented & evil. 🙁

    • I don’t know if it is orchestrated exactly but I would say the climate that creates such conditions certainly is. Many have a deep distrust of the government and that has gotten worse with this administration. They see cops and firefighters as government so they shoot because they don’t want them near.

      But there could be other reasons for this as well. Could be near a drug house or some insane idiot started the fire so they could shoot.

      • Orangeone

        Why is this reminding me of a recent event in an apt building sometime around the theatre shooting…..

        • Yeah it does sound familiar. One thing I know both my husband and I many years ago in the late 80’s and early 90’s worked as medics when going to school. We had to wear bullet proof vests in Oakland, Richmond and parts of SF because in the ghettos we were considered the same as cops.

          • Orangeone


    • Orangeone

      You are right. The father of the theatre shooter and the father of the CT shooting were both to testify in the LIBOR fraud scandal (under Barky Boy). Funny how there was an immediate settlement. CT shooter’s dad works in tax dept at GE and Immelt sits on Barky Boy’s economic advisory counsel.

      The other thing that has bothered me is the timing of Romney’s WH lunch with Barky Boy to talk about gun control and the CT shooting (Nov 29th lunch and December 14th CT shooting). Hummmmmmm

    • Shery Hancock

      It seems awfully coincidental that so many mass shootings under Obama’s watch have killed themselves, but before they went on their spree, they deleted their entire hard drives. Now, just WHY would they do that? Most of these types of shooters WANT the fame and infamy, the attention they get from these events. They don’t hide their pasts, or recent pasts unless there is something to be hidden…such as interactions with someone pushing them over the edge and urging them not to leave a trace. How many of these have we seen these past 4 years? Awfully fishy smelling lately!

      • Craig

        Try reading about the “Manchurian Candidate”. They kill themselves after their “brainwashed” program to kill. No loose ends, no clues back to the “programmers”. Yeah, seems like paranoid B.S. but it sure fits. It fits very well, unfortunately.

  • WHAT THE HELL IS GOING ON?!? America is LITERALLY falling apart in front of my eyes…EVERY SINGLE DAY a whole new tragedy occurs that shakes my perception of America even more.

    How did we get here and HOW THE HELL do we get back?!?

    • Rocco11

      Welcome to Obama’s amerika, where the Left has determined that a constant state of crisis, pressure, and agitation is most advantageous for advancing their agenda.

    • targetdestroyed01

      How did we get here? I can answer, how much time to you have?

      The truth: 40+ years of the welfare state, total loss of moral foundation being taught to children from parents (BOTH of them, not just one) and in schools, politicians who aquire and hold power by misuse of public funds and trust, and left leaning media bias covering it all up.

      This type of thing did not happen before the advent of the welfare state in the mid 1960’s. It is common now. Why? Because we accept it…little by little…each time morality is removed from school, when we buy a politicians lie that “you didn’t build that” or that “you don’t know what is good for you, only Washington DC politicians do”, we turn over or freedoms and our hard earned money to the state, we don’t fight moral decay, we reward and even glorify irresponsible behavior, and the truth’s we know are buried, belittled and condemned by left wing politicians and especially horrfically biased liberal media sources that, instead of acting as an adversary of big government as intended by the founding fathers, instead get in bed with the very monsters that have brought about our decay.

      That is how we got here. That is what your hard earned taxpayer dollars have wrought, what disinterest and inattention have built. This indicent is the very hallmark of 40+ years of lowest common denominator thinking, living and refusal to hold people responsible for their bad “lifestyle choices”.

      We got here because too many of our fellow citizens let it happen. This type of thing didn’t happen in the 1950’s and before. It does now. What changed? Short answer: Liberalism.


      • Marky_D

        Well said, I have seen the exact same thing as a result of the exact same thinking in my country too. I worry it is too late for the west to turn this rubbish around and we could be looking at the irreversible supremacy of ‘the rest’.

    • PatrickHenrysBody

      The MO of the adoring propaganda arm of Zero is to over-publicize and over-hype whatever occurrence manifests itself to further whatever agenda-du-jour is on the menu. They know that if they feed on the emotional, rather than the rational or logical, they will score easy points. The formula works and they know it.

      • Jay

        Absolutely. The word you’re looking for is “demagoguery.”

    • Craig

      as long as a president can get a B.J. in the WhiteHouse and NO ONE cares (in fact the media applauded him) and another president issues “executive orders” as if he is a dictator and NO ONE cares, how do you plan to “get it back”? We have at least two generations of people who think they are entitled to a free ride, gangs of murders, robbers, rapists and drug dealers roaming the streets and the police stay away from them and illegal aliens who are proclaimed to be the best and brightest among us and certainly entitled to a free ride so where do you want to start? Short of a civil war, I have no idea.

      • Jay

        Arlo Guthrie sarcastically said in “Alice’s Restaurant,” “You gotta sing louder if you want to end the war.” Today a lot of people send sharply worded emails around rather than getting out there and doing something.

        • Craig

          Jay, I’m 61, have two Honorable Discharges from the Army and was a Paramedic on a Fire Department. My wife was a Deputy Sheriff. Watch the firebombs, please. America has a cancer that has been growing for about 100 years. It will take a lot of guts and pain to cut it out. Worst of all, 51% of the country think it is all OK.

    • thankyou brian,
      for asking the proverbial question about “Gun Violence in America”….my solution would take more than 50 years to impliment & it means making a variety of changes (& not necessarily in this order). #1: Iliminating the sensationalization of violence in the media, TV News (Don’t you want to Know!!), internet & video games (I grew up on “Father Knows Best” & “Andy of Mayberry” etc.) #2: Removing “High Velocity” Assualt Weapons from the populas; (the 2nd ammendment was inacted during the period when the flintlock rifle was “state of the art”.) #3 Denying access to any firearm without rigirous backround checks…& lastly having a robust rewards program for volunteering information on those who are not following the rules. It is important to remember that “America’s Love Affair” with firearms is embrased by a minority!!!, & in a democracy, “majority rules!!!”…this comes from a “Pistol Permit” holder

      • Jay

        You’re wrong. The patriots had state of the art weaponry, why shouldn’t we? You think we’re in any less danger of falling into tyranny now than 238 years ago? Of course, judging by your spelling and ignorance of the Federal Form 4473, you may not have the education to grasp concepts such as these. I would suggest finding like-minded individuals at the Huffingglue Post.

      • Oh…so you’re an idiot…gotcha!

        • OK Brian
          Then what’s your solution???

          • I haven’t really thought about it, because there is NO WAY to end these types of scenarios. They have existed since the beginning of time, and without guns they will simply be perpetrated by other means.

            Tell me…how’s the War on Drugs going??? WHY would you want to copy that by implementing a War on Guns? Only criminals have Cocaine, and only criminals will have Guns if people like you have your way…

            THAT is NOT a solution…it’s better to do NOTHING, than to do what you want to do…

        • Craig

          We are a Constitutional Republic where MAJORITY rules, that is where the democratic part comes in.

          • The democratic part comes in where our REPRESENTATIVES vote on legislation openly, representing us. The REASON they implemented a Constitutional Republic is because they feared the “tyranny of the majority” (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyranny_of_the_majority), so the Republic gives the minority a powerful voice.

            The majority DOES NOT RULE in this country (or at least it hasn’t up until now).

  • poljunkie

    I just dont get it.

  • Nukeman60

    The more the media glorifies these killers by making their 15 minutes the most famous at any given time, these people will keep coming out of the woodwork. If they don’t do it with guns, they will do it with bombs, or homemade contraptions.

    The media is complicit. These killers should never get their names on TV. The media should never publicly go into their backgrounds and post pictures of them when they were 13 years old. Make them invisible and there won’t be the atmosphere of one-upmanship that is prevalent right now.

    This is the reason they are accelerating at an alarming rate – merely due to the advancement of the media ratings. It makes me sick.

    • Orangeone

      You are absolutely spot on Nuke! The media is causing this because of the constant coverage. We just had the Sunday “talk shows” bleeping about gun control which causes even more crazies to come out of the woodwork.

    • Sandra123456

      Agree 100%. If the murderer is dead or captured then there is no need to publicize their names or show their pictures.

      Don’t give any fame/infamy to the murderer.

    • PatrickHenrysBody

      Yeah, if there is a rash of murder by burning the victim to death, what are they going to do? Make fire illegal? Don’t worry, Zero and his propagandist media arm would find a way to get it done. It has been proven that their shame has no bounds.

  • Conniption Fitz

    This could very possibly be a meth lab fire and the shooter a druggie out of his mind.

    • hbnolikeee

      Terrorism? No such thing. It must be domestic violence.

      • Orangeone

        I’m sure it was just a misunderstanding …. /sarc

      • warpmine

        Workplace violence?

      • PatrickHenrysBody

        LOL…and police intervention would be a “contingency operation”. The overly-sensitive PC society we live in is sickening.

  • Immigrant_from_Socialism7

    The Socialists,Communists,foment problems and undermine Religion.
    America is the prize that outside enemies could never overcome.
    Only Patriotic Americans can save America from the Native born Socialists
    No one should expect the Premier to do what’s best for AMERICA

    Happy Christmas to all…and continued prayers for the fallen and ALL Service Members
    Thankful for being in the GREATEST COUNTRY ever envisioned,and for knowing that America will always do what’s right..after exhausting every other option (Churchill)

    • Well said my fellow immigrantfriend. God Bless and Blessed Christmas to you too.

  • Just terrible, and on Christmas Eve no less. Our prayers go out to those firemen and their families.

  • 12grace

    This is a terrible tragedy. My prayers are with the families and friends.

  • colliemum

    Prayers for the families of the two killed firemen – volunteers at that. My heart breaks for them, on Christmas Eve.

    Having read your comments, I agree that the one obvious trend here is the MSM publicising these crimes with fanfares as never before. Be prepared for more of these local events, terrible as they are, to be blazed across the national media, because they now fit the narrative of ‘all gun owners are potential criminals and murderers’.

    The MSM are in collusion here with the POS administration. There is one obvious ‘narrative’ which has been downplayed for years, and that is honour killings by muslims. No names, no names of victims, obscure little snippets in an obscure local paper – that’s all, never ever on national news.

    So it is possible to keep names out of the news, it is possible to downplay murder – when doing this fits the purpose of the POS.

    • c4pfan

      What’s any different than this site posting a thread on it?

      • colliemum

        Two small differences:

        1) rightscoop reports on what is already being reported, not to sensationalise but to draw our attention to how this is being “reported’ by the corrupt MSM;

        2) rightscoop is not ‘the MSM’, and scoopers are neither. Not yet anyway …

  • James1754

    May God bless them and keep them. May He watch over the families of the slain and bring the wounded home safe to their loved ones.

  • colliemum

    RE Update 3: Sooo – how did this criminal get that gun then? It is inconceivable that he would not have been flagged, had he applied in the proper way.

    But of course this little detail will never be asked about by the MSM who are pushing ‘gun crimes’ now as if there was no tomorrow.

    • Orangeone

      Ding, ding, ding mum. This wacko served only 17 years for murder. Another fine example of the liberals’ “rehabilitation”. Once a killer, always a killer. And to your point, a felon that is prohibited by law to own a firearm. Crickets because that doesn’t fit the liberals’ narrative.

  • How does it happen that a guy who murders his grandmother is released from prison, ever??

    • warpmine

      Liberalism: Lifetime incarceration is inhumane punishment.

    • Orangeone

      Cuz he was all better….sorry didn’t see your post until after I replied similarly to colliemum

  • NJK

    Socialists Blame Capitalism For Newtown Massacre…I don’t think these shooters are acting alone. Just my instinct. I think it’s a conspiracy.



  • guppymanster

    Proves the point that guns don’t shoot people, criminals shoot people.

  • America progressively being consumed by its own violence. Most Americans have remained quiet as their government commit crimes in Asia and Africa, with the latest being what we see in Syria. Their own are now targeting Americans at home.

  • I’m sure the question will be what sort of gun did this killer use. If it’s an AR15 or similar type of gun, this will not bear well for the NRA.

    • Orangeone

      Has nothing to do with the NRA. The NRA should be pointing out that a convicted felon, one that had previously committed murder, did it again so the recidivism for murder is this case is 100%. Liberal “rehabilitation” failed.

    • Bushmaster

  • MaxineCA

    Fox has a picture of this scumbag on their website. Must be the mug shot from 1980 since that would put him at 30 years of age. I swear, this guy looked like a meth head. I would love to have a look at his “lengthy criminal record”. As others have said, I can’t imagine why he didn’t get LIFE without the possibility of parole for murdering his grandmother. There were a few more interesting tidbits in the article.


    My heart breaks for all of the innocent people who his actions impacted.

  • Sober_Thinking

    Absolute sickness.

  • davienne

    this was a set-up. another false flag

    • Susan Harms

      explain whta you mean by that.

      • davienne

        according to the AP news… the house was an arson… he set the fire dept up.. as soon as they got there he started shooting….

  • poljunkie

    Who lets a career criminal walk out of jail, who by the way- murdered his Grandma?

  • So MSM..How does a convicted Felon/murderer w/mental problems go free to kill Firefighters???

  • MaxineCA

    Fox did an update on the story. I wondered how he murdered his grandma. Was it with a gun – nope. He beat her to death with a hammer!!!!! What kind of evil person does it take to do that? They also had a more updated picture of him. Very scary looking guy.

    I haven’t seen it updated on their website yet, but I’m sure they’ll rerun the story at the top of the hour on the Fox Report.

  • Landscaper

    Firemen’s jobs are dangerous enough. Now they are getting shot?

    • SineWaveII

      No, one psycho who was released from prison by liberals and who wasn’t allowed to own a gun; used his illegal gun to kill some people who happen to be firefighters. That’s what really happened.

      • Landscaper

        [no] Firemen’s jobs are NOT dangerous? [no] they were not shot?
        What was your point?

        • SineWaveII

          Sorry typo created confusion. Sorry about that, Landscaper. Merry Christmas.

  • Welcome the media-driven and Hollywood-driven anarchy to the streets of America in the 21st century.

    Let me guess… it was bunch of unarmed American’s that stopped the shooter, right? I mean, they must have been unarmed since that’s the only things that works according to Democrats, right?

  • Frank8881

    Put armed ex police officers and ex army on firetrucks. Someone phone NRA and let’s get this going.

    • Nukeman60

      Once again, always with your finger on the pulse. It’s really impressive how you can be so astute. What would the UK do in this situation? They haven’t had a killing with a gun in about 7,000 years now, wasn’t it?



      And before you ask me what my solution is, read down a few posts. I already told ya.

      • Frank8881

        No seriously turrets at the top of all trucks, cause it is a mental health issue that is the problem and the US is the only one with that problem.

        • Nukeman60

          If you want a serious discussion about gun control, then you should read this first:


          No, I mean seriously read it, not just spout off. Your arguments are way off, but we can discuss it intelligently. If you choose not to open your eyes to the words of a professional, then just spout off as you have been. We’ll be happy to take you down – again.

          • Frank8881

            Yea serious discussion that does not include any notion of any form of gun control….whatever…..arm the children

            • Nukeman60

              Somehow I knew you wouldn’t read it. That’s to be expected. Have a Blessed Christmas.

              • Frank8881

                You have a great Christmas too. I am busy reading Roger Ayles. That lefty communist liberal pinko, oh who runs Fox and also believes in some forms of gun control. These lefties are everywhere.

                • Nukeman60

                  Try reading some of the stuff given to you that you demand we show you. If you think Ayles is a conservative, then you need to do a lot more reading.

                • Frank8881

                  No Americans have it right, we need more guns. Even though we have the the most deaths and mass shootings. What we need is more people with guns lets not examine other countries with far better records and gun control. ARM THE CHILDREN

                • Nukeman60

                  I seriously think your keyboard is stuck. Either that or you’re the next 15 minutes of fame waiting to happen.

                • Frank8881

                  No worries tomorrow another 80 people will die, more then all the first nations of the world combined. But you and I know guns aren’t the problem.

                • Frank8881

                  UK gun homicides 2009 18


                  US gun homicides 2009 11,493


                  Yea those British should be really frightened maybe get them over and they can meet with you. You can let them know how they can get those % down. HAHAHAHA

                • Nukeman60

                  No worries tomorrow another 80 people will die, more then [sic] all the first nations of the world combined. But you and I know guns aren’t the problem.‘ – f

                  The amount of gun deaths every year has been declining since the 1980s. It is estimated that firearms are used 2 to 2.5 million times annually for self-defense. This means that firearms are 80 times more likely to save a life than to take a life.

                  The rate of motored vehicle deaths is still substantially larger at 42,000 deaths a year. Tobacco is still the #1 killer in the United States causing an average of 440,000 deaths a year.

                  You really do need to read some of the stuff that we send you. It would really help and save you a lot of embarrassment. Other than that, can you spew the same stat just once again? I don’t think we debunked it quite enough yet.

                • Craig

                  Frank, you are a coward. You do not feel the average American can be trusted with a firearm. Only the great educated elite and the government (ran by the great educated elite) can be trusted, they always have our best interests at heart, just ask Mao or Pol Pot. A coward never backs up his argument with proven facts. A coward distracts the facts against him with straw arguments (arm the children). Your facts are fraudulent, you position cannot be proven and your counter arguments are nothing but deflection and hyperbole. Frank, you are a coward.

                • Frank8881

                  UK gun homicides 2009 18


                  US gun homicides 2009 11,493


                  Yea those British should be really frightened maybe get them over and they can meet with you. You can let them know how they can get those % down. HAHAHAHA

                • Nukeman60

                  UK gun homicides 2009 18 http://www.gunpolicy.org/firea
                  US gun homicides 2009 11,493 http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/fastat

                  Yea those British should be really frightened maybe get them over and they can meet with you. You can let them know how they can get those % down. HAHAHAHA‘ – f

                  You really are getting boring, aren’t you. They don’t need to be frightened of me. They need to be frightened of their own crime rates.




                • Frank8881

                  Don’t talk % increase talk about whole numbers. You want to know how silly your stupid argument is a 100% increase in gun related homicides from 2009 to 2010 would mean 36 people died not 18 in the UK.

                  A 1% increase in American gun related crime deaths would mean 149 more people would die. Get it 100% increase and a 1% increase and 131 more Americans die.

                  Give your head a shake and look at the whole numbers your % arguments are dense. Only people with a weak minded case argues % with wide variances in baseline numbers.

        • Craig

          none so blind as those who will not see

        • SineWaveII

          Strawman alert!

    • SineWaveII

      Snide remark from a person with no facts

  • Nukeman60

    Update #3 shows just exactly what kind of person we are dealing with in all of these killings. He set it up to be able to kill multiple people, knew he wouldn’t get away, and killed himself in the end.

    Why do all this? For the glory and fame, why else. Otherwise just shoot yourself and get it over with. It seems pretty obvious to me what we must do. The media must stop immediately in glorifying these wackos. Bury their history and bio deep in the basement. Tell the public that a sick, demented wacko committed a crime and leave their name, picture and background out of the storyline. The police and professionals can take care of the details without the public being up front and in the know about every little detail.

    Once these wackos realize they won’t get that 15 minutes of fame, perhaps they won’t be so interested in being the next big story out there. That’s the only way we are going to break this string of insane incidents.

    The LameStream has to be held accountable. If they want to have an honest discussion about the causes, they better start right there.

    • Frank8881

      Yea that will fix it, no other nation has that problem. Perfect solution if we pretend it didn’t happen, it won’t happen again.

      • Nukeman60

        Uk gun crimes are on the rise. Uk police are sporting machine guns now. UK violent crime is out of control. Us gun crime is on the decline. Gun-free zones are insane. Keep them in your house and broadcast it. I will broadcast that I’m armed and trained. Let’s see who gets robbed first (and don’t call me. I won’t waste a bullet defending you).

        You like to spew rubbish, but you have no facts save for one wiki stat that means absolutely nothing and can compare to nothing. Read the article I suggested or get off the pot. Restating the same lame item over and over again that has nothing to do with the problem really doesn’t solve anything.

        But then you never really were interested in solving anything, were you. We knew that. You never responded to any of the links we posted to you before, so why do it now?

  • the killer couldn’t have a gun!! There is a LAW prohibiting felons to have guns! True!!!
    ReaLLY!!! rEALLY?
    Rrright, liberals –
    you are as sick as they,
    only they
    are not afraid to grab a hammer, a knife, a baseball bat, a gun.

  • PatrickHenrysBody

    Another one “falls through the cracks”. So the guy kills his grandmother and was released from prison. Makes perfect sense to me, seeing how our justice system works today. So is this what they mean by “rehabilitated”?

    The guy MURDERED somebody in the past. The guy was obviously found guilty by a jury of his peers and convicted. I suppose he would never kill anybody ever again after being released from prison, right? Hey, but we should feel sorry for these guys because they have it so hard in prison. Executing somebody for in essence executing somebody else is too cruel and unusual. They deserve another chance in society. Now a fire department is short two firefighters and two families are short loved ones, not to mention the two who were wounded and the massive property damage that occurred. Hey, we gave the d-bag another chance and it turned out to be a failure. Oh well, c’est la vie.

  • Craig

    proof, bloody and senseless as it is, that liberal rehabilitation of murderers and gun control fail miserably. It takes guts to live in a free society and a free society can never be a utopia. Only rats in a cage have “utopia”. May the two firefighters rest in peace and the other two recover.

  • cheyennecowboy

    Again, just enforce the current laws on the books. This “nut case” shouldn’t have even been out on the street in the first place. A killer on “supervised parole?” GIVE ME A BREAK! This guy was found guilty of MURDER. Should have been put to death then! Too many do-gooders and sob-sisters out there today. You take a life – You Die. Plain and simple truth, the death penalty is definitely a deterrent!

  • Sandra123456

    Do we need to know his name? He’s dead. Let’s remember his victim’s names and not his.

    • keyesforpres


  • Orangeone

    Grand jury indicted him for 2nd degree murder of his 92-year old grandmother with a hammer, pled down to manslaughter and then allowed to remain free on $15,000 bond until sentencing. What court does this? Yes, a rhetorical question.



    Ho Ho Ho or Ha Ha Ha,I don’t know whether to laugh or cry?I see Santa brought plenty of shiny,new Tin Foil Hats for all of the hate filled,bigoted,R/wingnut Conspiracy Wackos!Holy Jumping Jesus are you “people” depressing and scary as all hell,I don’t know how I found this Freak Show but I will be scrubbing my computer to wash the filth and slime away!One funny thing though, I bet many here call yourselves “Christian”,especially during this season , but you always leave out the most important part…HYPOCRITE!Oh yeah,Happy HOLIDAYS!!!

    • WordsFailMe

      Coming out of the clinic, back into the world without two weeks in “Out Patient,” must have been hell, but we’re glad you made it. I’t’ll be easier after the drugs are fully flushed out of your system. Try not to rush things, stay close to a toilet, you’ll be okay soon.


    I am searching everywhere for facts because I see some here already blaming Dems and this was all I could find,so please tell me if this is true or not …The criminal defender who helped this man go free is now a Judge who ran under a Republican ticket. The judge who approved his parole, also a Republican. Of the 5 member on the parole board 2 were Progressives 3 Republicans.The 3 that voted to let him go free on parole were the Republicans?

    • Nukeman60

      Wow, it sounds like this is a heavy Republican state. No, wait, it’s New York. Hmmm…

      Here, let me wish you a Blessed Christmas. I know it must burn like Holy water, but if you use plenty of soap, like you did on your now fried computer, you’ll be just fine. Please repeat after me – lalala, lalala…


    Nukeman–Holy water???And it burns(that’s some spooky trick),I never had that problem but obviously you do and should have an Exorcist look into that for you?Now since you had nothing of substance to comeback with on the reality front then you are saying yes,all that voted to let him go free were Repubs!Thanks ,Happy Holidays!!!

    • Nukeman60

      I didn’t think you would understand it. I could tell from your last post.


    From the Manchurian Candidate to Arlo Guthrie to Zero orchestrating it all,I have now read all the comments here and have one thing to add…GET MENTAL HELP,IMMEDIATELY!!!Your membership manifesto should begin with …”Check ups from the neck up for all!”Really now,it’s not too late,come back to the USA,Planet Earth,it’s still the greatest place to live!

  • Conniption Fitz

    Another update: Another body found in shooter’s home, believed to be his sister.

    He should never have been let out of prison, and likely should have been executed years ago for killing his grandmother with 36 blows of a hammer while on drugs.

    • Sandra123456

      See how executions could prevent future crime?

      Public executions by noose or electricity in the public square would deter even more crime.

  • justplainbob

    This tragedy occurred one mile from me as the crow flies. These men were our neighbors…members of our community. Outstanding members of our community ! Killed for what ? The man who did the killing was an ex con who already had killed his grandmother with a damn hammer ! And yet, he only served 17 years in prison. Why was he ever let out ? This is not about gun control. This is about those who are mentally deranged who are using illegal weapons to do the evil deeds that they do. May this Spengler guy rot in hell ! We mourn the loss of these two fine gentlemen who were ambushed. We pray for the recovery of the two firemen who are still in guarded condition at Strong Memorial Hospital and we pray for the recovery of our community. There are no easy answers and we never, ever expected anything like this to happen so very close to home. I do not know what else to say. God bless us all.

    • ApplePie101

      Instead of publicizing the names of gun owners, we should be publicizing the names of the lawyers, judges and parole board members who release heinous criminals like this on the population. Then they want to deprive law-abiding citizens of all means of protecting themselves.

  • jeepninety

    Look sorry for the loss of American lives and especially our emergency services. But in research, Emergency was surveying Spangler and interfering with his ability change and be forgiven for what he has done in the past. His ability to gain employment and keep it, ability to love and be loved his civil rights where being violated by Emergency services of that county. His past of the murder of his grandmother had the attention of Emergency services, he paid for his crime and the emergency services of that country had him in their sights. They were clandestinely stalking him, violating his every move to improve the quality of his own live. People make mistakes in their lives and the judicial system punishes them but after completing successfully his punishment, the country continued to punish and abuse him. So he set them up! He saw what was going on and life with the government on your back at times seems to be not worth living. In this research I apologize for their losses but the emergency services, mainly the fire dept. with the support of law enforcement and all emergency services were in the wrong and this man defended his honor. Which I don’t agree and am sorry for the loss, Emergency services need to survey without interfering with the targets lively hood if within the law. SORRY FOR THE LOSS but speaking from experience and never being a convicted felon but have researched and are suspicious of Emergency services. Thank you for your time. RAW! Emergency services needs to be investigated by federal authorities for the violation of Americans Civil and Constitutional rights. People do change and want and need to be forgiven!